Conventional political sentiment tells us that we are either for a particular proposition, or against it. We are told to support Proposition 8 if we believe in traditional marriage, or against if we believe in equality. What about those who believe that a government authority empowered by a simple majority, should not have the authority to tell dissenters that they have to share the majority’s proclaimed moral virtues? What if we should not be debating equality or traditional marriage per se, but a deeper question; should we be governed by the whimsical morality of the majority, regardless of the issue? Should it matter whether I personally believe or don't believe in gay marriage? Is it not self-righteous to put my moral grounds on a pedestal and force others to accept my belief?
Minorities come in many different forms and as the Founders of this country understood, the individual is the smallest and greatest minority of all. So what if I believe in the equality not of the collective gay minority, but in the equality of each individual inside and out of that minority to construct his or her own set of moral convictions? If Person A and Person B want to get married, and Church C thinks it’s a good idea, why should I have the right to check their pants first? I believe our government should protect individual rights, and not individual words, and that if Church A should differ from Church B in it's definition of marriage, the churches should have the right to use different dictionaries.
It always amazes me that the traditionally conservative small government voters are the ones that support issues like this. On one hand, they demand that the government get out of our lives. On the other hand, they ask the government to protect their definition of marriage.
It always amazes me that the traditionally liberal progressives are for equal rights for all. On the one hand they demand that government protect the rights of minorities. On the other hand, they ask the government to force everyone else to accept their definition of marriage.
I am not gay and I am not married. If gays are allowed to get married, I will continue to search for a woman, and I will continue to desire a traditional marriage. Frankly, I think proposition 8 is a lot less about marriage than it is about the role of government in our lives. So, I will cast a No vote on proposition 8 not because I am against defining traditional marriage. I will cast a No vote because I believe in the right of everyone else to disagree with my definition.
Separation of Church and State
The "Gay" issue set aside, I strongly disagree with using the CA or US Constitution to restrict and limit individual rights and freedoms. The Bill of Rights was created specifically to codify and protect our rights, not limit them.
With that said, I think the government should lose its right to grant marriages all together. It should only have the power to grant civil unions, ceding authority to define "marriage" to religious institutions. With that, from a legal stand point, everyone is treated equally and religious institutions a granted greater control over what constitutes a marriage to them. Of course if you want your marriage legally recognized you would still need to register for a civil union.
I am fascinated by the proponents of prop. 8 on this. I have heard little to no valid argument from them supporting this proposition. Its the same two arguments that were given to support slavery, prevent inter-racial marriage, and maintain other social wrongs: 1)to protect the status-quo and 2)because the bible says so. In this country you need a better reason than both of those to take away someones rights.
Also, the religious right seems to be especially hypocritical with this proposition. If they did indeed seek to protect marriage, they should reject prop. 8 and demand something with more teeth: No gay marriage, no divorce, adultery should be a crime. After all, Corinthians 6:9-10 puts adulterers on the same level as homosexuals. From what I've seen of recent statistics, half of the US population is desecrating marriage without any help from the gay community.
Actually, if you carefully
Actually, if you carefully examine the links to official school board documents in which the "yes on 8" campaign folks have included in one of their commercials, you would see that CA schools are not forced to provide comprehensive sexual health education. However, if they do, all it requires is that students are taught to respect marriage and committed relationships. The end. www.cde.ca.gov/ls/he/se/sexeducation.asp
NO on prop 8
I love that people just want to "pretend" that gay people do not exist in our country. To compare someones' love and choices in life to a BMW speaks volumes of how ignorant you are in life. Many couples that I know were man and woman taught and practiced "traditional" ways and they all fell apart too, and it wasn't because they were gay. The manual just needs to be updated. We are all human beings and we should treat each other with the respect and same constitutional rights because WE ARE HUMAN, not because we are either gay or straight. GOD does not govern our country/state he purely exists on faith. Just because you don't "believe" in it why would you want to discriminate against someone who simply has a different way of life.
Biblical Marriage
We all know this election is probably the most important election in the history of this State and Nation. Not only are we voting for/against an African American candidate or female candidate, but we are also voting for/against maintaining the laws that have changed the dynamics of " Biblical Marriage". After looking at both sides, I am not voting politically, personally, or ethically... I'm voting what I feel is biblical. I do believe in preserving the "Biblical Marriage" title for relationships between men and women because it is this god-given relationship that allows 2 people to come together as one (sex) to keep human life in existence. When this relationship is maintained correctly it is extraordinarily special because this relationship is responsible for aiding in the creation of life. I don't feel any other relationship should be given the opportunity to maintain the same title, because no other relationship has this god-given responsibility. I do believe in loving all groups of people and I am for equal rights but I don't feel it is OK to expand the title of "Marriage" to anything but a man and woman's relationship. Most peoples argument against what I'm saying is "Who am you to say this isn't OK because were all equal", or "You're not loving all god's people by saying these things", or that men and women have children before they are married, or they have children accidentally, or these relationships get divorced 68/90% of the time so why not try things differently? My response to this is, loving people is not always just giving them what they want. The bible lays out the dynamics of relationships in a way that makes the relationship the most healthy and prevents disaster. The bible is against having premarital sex and it outlines grounds for divorce. What society has done is steered the wheel of what is "Ok and fair" in peoples eyes to favor what they feel is best for themselves, and 90% of the steering goes against what we were created to do. This started in the beginning with Adam and Eve's temptation. Although at one point I contributed to this problem, I dont want to continue to do so.
Church
There is not a church of any TRUE Christian/Jewish faith that would say Party A and Party B should be married. They would only say Man and Wife, male and female, because that is what the bible says. The idea of "If Person A and Person B want to get married, and Church C thinks it’s a good idea..." is not an arguement because Church C would never say that. It is VERY clear in both the new and old testement that God is against homosexual relationships. As Christians we do love all people, but what is your definition of love? Love is not an emotion, it is an act. Love is God-Obedience. When you love somebody, you help them obey the word of God because that word is our manuel for how to live the most healthy and fullfilling life. If you buy a BMW and the Maker of the vehicle writes a manuel that says to put in premium gas, you dont put in unleaded or you will eventually have a lot of problems with the car and it will break down earlier than its life expectancy. Same thing is true for our lives and loving others. God as our creator created this manuel, the bible, for how we should live our lives to get the most out of life. If we stray or let others stray than our society as a whole begins to break down and have we begin to have serious problems. Another example is parents. If you have children, you dont love them by allowing them to only eat ice cream, or play in the street at night... You set boundries BECAUSE YOU LOVE THEM.
Don't Damage Our Constitution
It is not appropriate to write discrimination into the California Constitution and to treat one group of citizens differently from another. California is a leader in the environment, technology, and entertainment industry. Let's keep our world-class status. This is California, not Calabama.
Vote No on Proposition 8.
Support for proposition 8
Support for proposition 8 comes from pure dogmatic belief. The last church I went told it's members to support prop 8 only because that position was in line with the bible.
Support for a ban on gay marriage is support for discrimination. This ban singles out a group of people and denies them a right given to other groups.
Yes on 8
"It always amazes me that the traditionally liberal progressives are for equal rights for all. On the one hand they demand that government protect the rights of minorities. On the other hand, they ask the government to force everyone else to accept their definition marriage." I agree with your observation and I commend you for your honesty. I agree church A and church B can have different forms of marriage. The problmem comes when we legislate acceptance (rather than tolerance) of behaviors some find objectionable (right or wrong, it's their opinion), at that point, a case will be made, mark my words, that those who preach against homosexuality in the privacy of their churches will be accused of hate speech (some are already being accused of bigotry simply for expressing their support for Prop 8)
If our schools weren't
If our schools weren't forcing the liberal vision of marriage on my kid then I wouldn't care one way or the other. However, liberals in charge of our schools are RIGHT NOW indoctrinating our kids on what they want our kids to think.
They must be stopped. Yes on 8 is the fastest way to do it.
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